Staff tips

there is another eating establishment I could mention the name of that uses a proportion of the staff tips to actually pay for their contracts and the owners also take a share for themselves, it is actually one of the busiest restaurants in the local area,....what a bloody cheek!! and the best bit about it is the staff are only on 4.50€ an hour,...I know this because my wife enquired about a job there when we were having a meal the once,....needless to say she rapidly lost interest in the vacant position.......... Yes times are hard, but to take the micky like that is truly uncalled for :0(

Its up toevery bar owners to decide how they run their business and what the pay. BUT, our policy is that tips are shared between everyone inc the person washing up, they all contribute to the bigger picture, I also think that that sort of wage is not enough for the hard work involved. All our staff can also have free food and drinks and all the girls sit down to a Sunday lunch when things start to slow down. That's how we decide to run our business.

WOW Can't believe that this is happening. Look out owners I will now be asking the question to you. I only tip for the staff it is not meant for the owners. Staff in restaurants are never on a good wage that is one of the reasons they get tipped. Bloody Cheek of those owners.
Happy New Year to all

Its up to every bar owners to decide how they run their business and what the pay. BUT, our policy is that tips are shared between everyone inc the person washing up, they all contribute to the bigger picture, I also think that that sort of wage is not enough for the hard work involved. All our staff can also have free food and drinks and all the girls sit down to a Sunday lunch when things start to slow down. That's how we decide to run our business.
Commented [email protected] in La Marina about 3 hours ago

Good for you that way you keep good staff and have a happy atmosphere all round (a lot of people for get how it reflects back on customers).

Maybe such bars should be named or at the least make it clear where or who benefits from tips

I work in a restaurant on the urb and all the tips come to me and my colleague, our bosses wouldn´t even dream of keeping the tips for themselves, enough said

Working for 4.50 an hour is unbelievable,I was a cleaner in a restaurant over 8 years ago and getting 7.50 an hour then.

So lets name and Shame them! Waiters and cooks do not earn a fortune, so they deserve their tips! If I work with my staff, I will NEVER take a penny in tips, even though some nights I can do the worst jobs and work as hard as anyone! I know of these places, and the same ones do not give a contract, even thought they say they will, but its not my place to name anyone. If the customers know, then please share the facts. Even if you still want to go there, pay the waiters directly, without the owners knowing, or leave no tip at all!

the establishment I mentioned earlier on in this thread also had a lad working for them doing waiting on and washing up,....after working nearly 60 hours they only paid him around 200€ and I'm pretty sure that also included a meagre share of the tips,...I will not name said establishment but I will state that it is on the grey area!

Don't know of one there? The main one is near SupaValue where the Police station is. A lot of disgruntled staff not been paid, no contracts and definitely no tips.
No contract means, no social security, which means, no medical, no unemployment benefit or pension! Absolutely disgusting!

R- moreton. That one on grey area has been doing it for 11 years , there must be 2 by super value because the one I know of is new, maybe we should name because the owners get there profits and it's hard work here for the employees ......

Well if it is in the grey area, it is not Bonnies or the Grill House then, as they are both closed at the moment, so I think that leaves the French Restaurant, Rammons, Anandas or the Indian.

To clarify that I work at the French restaurant and like I stated before, on one of the post above, my boss Philippe and Francine would not dream of taking our tips away from me us, not their style. Thanks

Winterbottomandsophie you are talking about the same ones I am, I am pretty sure? If you are one of the ex employees there, that is still owed money etc...
Why don't you NAME AND SHAME THEM!! Paying for social security Taxes and wages etc.. are the biggest cost for a restaurant, so when one thinks they are
above the law, and save on this, not only its not fair competition, but the employees are hard done by for now and the future. And we want to line pockets of these restaurant owners?

Actually Linda grill house is open, has been all over Xmas . I will name them because I think it is wrong the 2 I know of is grill house and mulberry , I put 20 cents in bill tray and give the staff tip in there hand.

I have to say that I have heard alot about the Grill House in this respect. I cannot believe bosses do something like that to their employees! As for Mulberrys, well, I knew a waiter there that confirmed this about the tips and also was not given any contract as promised! Not the best way to do business!

well winterbottomandsophie you certainly got the one on the grey area right,.....but I've not heard anything about the other place,..yet!,...other than what you have mentioned.... but then again I only tend to use the angel bar over that side of the urb.
Lets hope that the offending bar/restaurant owners take some notice of what has been posted on this thread and clean their acts up a bit or in some cases clean their act up a lot !! without their waiting on, cooking and cleaning staff they would not have a business to run and then they would be forced to work under some of the dire conditions they subject their own staff to,...please note that I am not tarring all establishments on the urb with the same brush,...maybe some of the disgruntled ex-staff from these said "popular" establishments would like to comment on their experiances working for such places and if they want possibly name and shame, that way we can all decide for ourselves where we appropriate our spare cash from our hard earned pensions/jobs,...just a thought !!

Customers! You have the power to do something about this! Either by confronting the owners or not going at all to those offending restaurants.
Of course confronting the owners, they will say its not true (one of them will actually smile I your face!!) and carry on. If you still want to support
this type of business, then at least sneak the tips to the waiter! Any other restaurants doing the same?

Couldn't agree more with you Joe. I feel sorry for the staff that slave away only to be left with nothing in the end! How heartless can someone be? I am sure these bosses would not like it if the tables were turned!

Cagneys bar is rapidly approaching its 4th anniversary. When we took over we were totally at the hands of the existing staff. We were told that all the tips went to the cook because that was the hardest job. We had no idea so we went along with it until it was pointed out to us by the bar staff that this was wrong. Nearly four years on and we have never taken a penny from our staff in tips. We changed our policy when we realised that things were dreadfully wrong in the bar. Please understand that we will still be a EURO bar on 1st. January 2014 but bear in mind that every January 1st for ALL the bars on the urb the beer barrels go up in price by 4euros. This might not sound a lot but cagneys has been a euro bar for 10 years now so that is an increase of 40 euros a barrel!! This cost has been absorbed but sadly people still complain when the drinks go up 10cents. Spare a thought for the bar owners on the urb before complaining about the extra cents. People were paying a euro 10 years ago when the urb was buzzing. It's still a euro now when our urb is dead. Think on!! On a lighter note can we thank our VERY loyal customers a fabulous new year and can we thank
them all for supporting our bar. Without you we would not still be open. ( especially those in today, what a fabulous afternoon, you made our day!)

thought this thread was about tips? who cares if the beer goes up by 10 cents? if people are going to complain about 10 cents then they should stay at home,..good lord! they would be worse off being back in England and paying £4+ for a pint,....although it makes me laugh at times when I see people DRIVING the length and breadth of the urb to save a few cents on a pint not even realising it's just cost them 3€ in fuel to find the cheapest drink!! every bar on the urb is within 20 cents of each other on the price of a pint,..some people just need to get a grip,....or are these the kind of people who refuse to leave a tip...hehehe

Tips to waiters, postmen, supermarket cashiers, sanitation workers, electricians, doctors, nurses, ................................and all others who are working. Doesn´t anyone have a fixed salary?
But there is something called "sevice included." Unknown phenomenon?
Just kidding (if someone feel he or she is offended).

Some people are desperate for a job. They get 1.50 euro an hour (know of one bar in Benihofer!) La Marina some only pay slightly more!
NO contract no minimum wage take it or leave it! They are then promised "you will make your money up with tips". So the owner takes the tip jar home
and says there was only this much (20% or less of what is was!) here is your 2 euro tip for the week! This I heard from 2 waiters desperate to find
another job! Slave labour here is still a problem, and its fairly easy to see which places operate this way! But there are plenty of other restaurants that
look after their staff, and you always see the same waiters in certain restaurants, and these are the "looked after" ones!

Gallows, Spain is a little bit different as that seen from the top of Kiln Lane. Usually the owners here run around doing everything on top of paying mind numbing social security payments. I find it astonishing that any bar can make money here. I do hope that the staff at the bars/restaurants mentioned gave their ok as the owners may decide to have a clear out in the new year.

Marko, When you say the social payments are so high you could not be more right! So when you see someone offering a breakfast for 2 euro, or 2 meals for 5 euro, the math does not add up!
You cannot afford to do this, pay staff, social rents and insurances and make a profit. Not to mention what poor quality food provided, every corner has to be cut just to afford to produce food at this price! I have tried some of these cheap breakfasts, and some did actually taste OK, only one ever gave me food poisoning, but ALL of these places have since closed. Next time someone wants to drive around to save 10 cents on a beer, just think, what corners may have been cut? So its no wonder the owners steal tips from the staff! However the above mentioned
restaurants, its actually more greed than just making the math work! Social payments in Spain are at Approx 40% of the salary earned! No wonder so many people wont give a contract!

gallows.milnrow, why only tip the waiter/waitress if the food is good? Who has made the food taste good? You can have good service and bad food. Never thought about that?

Maybe we ought to rid ourselves of the outlets that do not offer a contract or pay a minimium wage as both are a legal requirement then we would have a level playing field where the best legal companies survive not just those cutting the biggest corners. Yes I am aware our breakfast prices would rise but I am sure we are all aware that the prices charged now are too low.

Exactly!!! Pay a euro or 2 more get the quality, ensure the staff are paid (although I know 1 person who will still rip them off!) and no need to support the illegal business!

You and I both know this will not happen as there are to many cheapskate moaners here to do that ( its what gives them a purpose for getting up in the morning / mid day ) !!!.

Yes I agree. Don't people think what possible crap they are putting into their bodies? Was not that long ago that restaurant in Guadamar gave everyone food poisoning, and 2 ladies died!
YOu are putting your trust in somebody when you are at a restaurant! Remember the golden rule, "If they cannot be bothered to clean the toilets, the kitchen will be no better!!!"

that sounds disgusting to me I tip good service and a polite waitress, not so they bar owner can benefit.
Senora Alto

Well if you want my opinion, I don't see where the tips go is anything to do with anybody, other than the staff and the management. For a start there is always an arrangement between the management and the staff re tips, one example being if the till is short, management make it up from the tips, although this is not always the case.

Marv obviously you have never ran a restuarant or if you have then it would be the type of place where the owners steal the tips.
Poeple who work in this type of service sector get paid peanuts so tips are really needed to make their wages up.
The tips should be shared between all staff the cleaners, chefs and waiting on staff and all others concerned.
They should never be used to make up for shortfalls in the till for what ever reason e.g theft, under charging or bilking.
Lots students and low paid start in these jobs and to take their tips is really really wrong they work long unsociable hours for low pay.How mean must some places be to take these tips.

As a footnote a ate at Mulberrys when i recently visited and would not have done so if i knew that the management took the sta
ffs tips.

Well marv obviously never had a business here, it is to do with us when an employee is desperate for work they may say yes to anything, that does not mean the employer can treat them like slaves ..

Its disgusting! Make a stance and avoid them! I have been told they will never change their habits they have always done so! The staff need to walk out, but when you are desperate, you cannot
and slavery will continue. If those business close because nobody goes, we can only hope it will be replaced with someone that has morels! But it is an awful situation happening under our noses
in a modern country? Maybe in the countries they are from its normal, but it is not normal for us! Not trying to be racist, just trying to understand why/how they can do this?

I can understand what you are saying regarding low pay, the point about tips is that these can make low pay if the establishament is right a decent wage the tips supplement the low wage.
However if these tips are not given then
1 What does these do to staff moral.
2 Why should the staff go the extra mile to make the customer feel special.
3 What does it tell you about the type of establishment that people are eating in, if they will cut corners on the tips what other corners will they cut.
I'm still reading with shock that some establishments will take their staffs tips as their own it is shameful and morally incorrecct.

Well I have run a business here, and a restaurant business as well, and tips need thinking about. For example part time staff that only work 1 or 2 days a week. Should the tips be shared out on the days when the part timers work, or paid out weekly, what about if on the days the part timers work the till is consistently short, I know you will say sack the culprit, but what if the culprit is not found out for weeks. What happens if a staff member gets a tip and doesn't deposit it in the tip box. You see it's not always black and white.

Tips should be paid out every day? The staff that have worked that day should be rewarded. If a part time worker is working on that day pay them the deserved tips of that day only. If you take the tips home then share them at the end of the week, then that is where the problems are, because money is removed when the staff are not there! I always let the staff count their own tips and divide them among themselves, on that day, so that I cannot be blamed for taking them! I would be embarrassed! If money is missing from the till, then, and only then, it should come from the tips. That way, it will only happen probably once! The moral of the staff is a very good question. Just heard (from a reliable source) the head waiter from Mullberrys has left? So how have people found the service from the 2 offending restaurants? Are the waiters unhappy? Have they told you to NOT pay a tip as they won't get it anyway? Or they plodding along happy they have a few euro to take home?

Marv what points you raised are good and relevant but as the owner it is up too you to make sure the tips are distributed to the right people for the right amount of work.
As for theft it has no place in any business and non trustworthy can uaually be taken care off just by a process of elimination through shift patterns.
If i was a member of staff and my tips went to make up a shortfall in the till i would make it be know to all the customers and other staff that this is not right.
The managemnet are responsible for making sure that the money and bills add up not the waiting on staff and i know its a grey area but if a restuarant is run right then the two should never collide.
The waiters/waitressess serve the management collect the money and if theft is occurring it could well be any or all of these that are doing it.
Then it is just poor managemnet selection by owners that lets this occurr.

Please do not think that this is "Crumbs" (newly opened by Supavalu) as I pay the staff daily and certainly more than 4.50 per hour. Also, the tips are shared out daily.

I worked for the Grill House for 3 years off and on and the tips are divided equally between the staff, they do not keep the tips for themselves at all, so its definately not them

Well said.

some of these bars dont pay their staff at all.
my girlfriend worked for months with no pay & lee crawly from the white swan went back to the UK leaving his parents to pay his depts. & because we had the audasity to ask for the €400+ they owed, they told us "sod of we dont care your not getting it. Lied about putting her on contract too!.
P.S. I want everyone to know what liers they are & I´m not affraid to name tem either.
Eh bet & collin! your scum!!!!!!!!!!

I know a few bars that do this & tell their staff there on contract only to find out their not.

Please name them!! There are loads, you are right! Grill house IS one of them! I know of a waiter promised a contract and never got one!

I keep reading comments "its up to the bars what wages they pay" The min wage applies to all bar staff and should be observed along with a contract.

Bars should follow the minimum wage with the contract. But if you don't give a contract you can pay whatever you get away with! People are desperate and need money. Its the Greedy ones that really take advantage and pay 1-2 euro a hour, which is way below the minimum wage and then they save on the social! These people need to be reported by the staff that are ripped off because they have the proof! We know its happening, but we cannot prove it!

There shouldn't be any promises for a contract, if you work you must have one fight for your rights at the end of the day all businesses need staff so stick together and make your demands ..

Not sure if I am understanding you, but you must have a contract to work! If you want to "try someone out", see if they are good for the business, you get a day, week or month contract! Yes it seems a bit over the top if you want to try someone, but even for 1 day you must have a contract! Of course, if you are not caught, who will know, but the fines are massive now if you are caught without a contract! But also, if you have a contract, you then WILL have to have at least the minimum wage as required by law. If you have an accident at work, you will not be covered, you will be able to have a sips card for medical attention, and you will be contributing towards a pension, or unemployment benefits! Go to the social office in Elche, explain your situation, and they will sort the employer out real good!!

I see many families going back to the UK because they can not earn enough to stay. Some of the bar owners are making good money. Maybe we need a union type thing were every bar offers the min wage and contract or the union reports them. That would let maybe 50 families stay in La Marina and the cost would be spead amongst the thousands that use any bar in La Marina. It might just be the start of a sustainable life style for many more working families.

Do any of you know what you are talking about, put up the prices to allow more money to be paid in wages, and stay in Spain. The minute a bar puts up its prices, the customer drop off, Why do you think these bars do a good trade, it's because the prices are right.

Thats why it has to be enforced on all bars

If all bars have a fair price what choice do cheap moaners have??? And yes more people would stay in Spain making it possible for everybody to survive, fairly!
Cannot believe somebody is stupid enough to try and suggest there is place for bars/restaurants to rip staff off, to lower prices! And bars that do this, are ones
that are making most money, before they caught and leg back to UK!

OK so according to the majority vote,bars must put up prices to pay staff more. So it follows that the restaurants most of you go to are the expensive ones, because obviously, the most expensive restaurants can afford to pay their staff more. I don't think this is a very intelligent argument, as most people choose a cheaper Restaurant, eg. Menu of the day €7,50 another menu of the day with identical menu €9,50, which one you choose.

It would be interesting to see if peope if informed of the way that a restuarant treated their staff still went in even though it might be cheaper.
I for one would boycott a place that stole the staff tips or didn't pay the minimum wage.
If a business cant make a profit legally then its not a viable business and anything else is just greed.
You can still make a profit even when being competitive if the food and service is good, you just have to serve more customers and make sure the place is busy.
I dont think cutting corners is the way forward and how you should run a business.

"You can still make a profit even when being competitive if the food and service is good, you just have to serve more customers and make sure the place is busy."

Wow Nick, ever thought of being a Business Consultant?

Up to now, from what I've read on this site, it's only hear-say. If employee's have a problem with their employer's, then they should report them.

In my opinion the restaurants that are fiddling their workers and the government are as bad as the immigrants back in the UK paying their fellow countrymen slave wages and not paying their taxes. I used to hate those companies back in the UK and I am finding more and more Spanish that are getting resentful.

I think we know the offending people and the business they run, so lets not go there, and add fuel to the problem!! Teach these crooks that crime does not pay!

Joe, perhaps you should re-read your 10+ previous comments before suggesting 'not going there' and 'adding fuel to the problem'. Why don't you name a crook?

Joe from the way you talk I should think that the landlords would prefer you not to go to their bars.

Marko, If you read the comments crooks already named! Marv, you can be sure I would never go there anyway